Anita Sarkeesian discussion



  • @Soundmonkey44:

    I think it's sad so many people abuse sociopolitical views to push their own agendas. Feminism is about creating equality between men & women, not some stupid battle of the sexes!

    Anita it seems is a Radical Feminist, and as we all know, radical anything is NOT good!

    Personally I think the EcoFeminist & Liberal Feminist (which is actually quite moderate despite its name) movements are much better and more well rounded. Radical Feminists all to easily turn into shamers & bullies.

    Yeah, at its heart, the intent of feminism is good. The goal is just plain old equality. But then you get people who take things too far and take advantage of situations and it makes it just that much harder for everybody.



  • I’ll see fit to take feminism seriously and approach it with respect when they acknowledge misandry exists, that there’s a major problem with the male suicide rate; 80% of suicides are males aged 14 – 44. When they address male victims of domestic violence which ranges between 40% - 49%, when they actually take female on male rape seriously, to which I know they don’t; I can speak from first person experience on that.

    It would be great if they didn’t exile feminists like Warren Farrell, who is now an MRA, because he wanted to stay true to the belief of feminist equality by speaking on behalf of issues affecting men and boys, and the feminists he aligned himself with wanted nothing to do with it. Then there’s Erin Prizzy who wanted to help male victims of domestic violence, I believe she opened the first domestic violence shelter for men, which yielded the reaction of death threats from feminists. I recently heard of a feminist in Sweden who is receiving death threats on account that she’s questioning feminism.

    Anita Sarkeesian is hardly a problem, I think she's just using feminism to line her own pockets; famous feminists like Germaine “Victim Blamer when it’s male” Greer believes men can’t be raped; it's people like that who are a real problem.

    Then there’s the need to silence different views on gender issues with shaming and bullying; something I’ve seen many feminists from different places do. From some of the more radical feminists on Pony Forums; I mean, the way the male users on their knees there; it's pathetic. Then there are more moderate ones on anime forums I've debated with, who while just as unpleasant as the pony ones at least took the time to engage and argue their points, they were unsuccessful, but at least they tried, then there are jerks like Zac and Justin.

    I remember Justin’s antics on that one Podcast where he insulted men's rights groups, then Zac once compared men’s rights supporters to white supremacists; their bigotry and ignorance couldn't be more obvious. The fact that Zac uses “MRA” to insult people who actually want to talk about sexism being two way goes to show how big of an idiot he is. I think people like them need to visit a site like Jezebel just to see some of the hate speech around there.

    The bottom line here; people who proclaim themselves feminists best start understanding the pendulum of sexism swings both ways; something I have seen them fail to do time and time again.

    I could sit here and rant on and on about the narrative that we live by; the fact that misandristic feminist art that endorses violence against men is actually government funded, or feminists articles can freely call boys “rapists in waiting” or my personal favorite; the “Don’t be the guy” campaign telling men not to rape.

    Oh, and if you’re a member of the male gender; you’re not allowed to be offended at such detrimental messages.

    I’m going to stop there before this rant gets longer. As for my write up on sexism on anime, I just finished the “Failure of the Bechdel Test” section, which will be followed up with how misguided executives alienate an entire demographic; so you see, my write up is taking so long because I’m not looking at sexism from a one sided mentality, although, I will admit; I do put more emphasis on misandry simply because we conveniently never hear about it. And yes, it is taking a while.



  • I know one can only judge things by their personal experiences Neon. But dismissing an entire movement just because of the bad eggs is a fairly crude thing to do. One of my college professors I'm friends with that teachers some of the political & multicultural classes at the campus is a feminist, and he's a great guy.

    He's also A Wonder Woman fan, which makes him even more awesome IMO.

    I mean yes many big political/media figures in social movements are dicks, but I like to think most on the ground level are pretty good peeps.



  • @Soundmonkey44:

    I know one can only judge things by their personal experiences Neon. But dismissing an entire movement just because of the bad eggs is a fairly crude thing to do.

    A few bad eggs? Really? Yeah no, I’ve met a small number of Equality Feminists, the ones who look at sexism as a two way street, and they’re as elusive and hard to encounter as the Loch Ness Monster.

    @Soundmonkey44:

    One of my college professors I'm friends with that teachers some of the political & multicultural classes at the campus is a feminist, and he's a great guy.

    Ask him about male rape or domestic violence victims; if one in four women are sexually assaulted at some point in their lives, one in six, or even one in five men, dependent upon the studies, are sexually assaulted at some point in their lives, and some studies even point towards young boys being raped more than young girls with 40% of the perpetrators being women.

    @Soundmonkey44:

    He's also A Wonder Woman fan, which makes him even more awesome IMO.

    That’s great; so will feminists think I’m cool because I really like the last story arch of Revolutionary Girl Utena?

    @Soundmonkey44:

    I mean yes many big political/media figures in social movements are dicks, but I like to think most on the ground level are pretty good peeps.

    The problem is the dominant and most influential voices in the movement that people follow have taken things to pretty extreme levels. The moment I hear people start talking about fighting the patriarchy or male privilege I just want to roll over laughing.

    The fact is, the rhetoric has been crammed down my throat for the last 25 years, after some of the encounters and experiences I had, I’m starting to barf it all up.

    I hear what I'm told, I see what is; two completely separate things.



  • The large majority of feminists publicly claim to seek equality in public, private, and social settings, but the hidden agenda is to seek betterment, which has a tendency to mean two totally different things, so a lot of feminists, in my opinion, don't really deserve recognition for their efforts until they can either practice what they publicly claim, or change their claim to their true goal

    Anyway carry on



  • @neon: well he's already stated our gender communications class will cover both feminist & men's rights movements. As well as problems and stereotypes both men & women face in society, he's a pretty well rounded guy. IMO anywho.



  • @Soundmonkey44:

    well he's already stated our gender communications class will cover both feminist & men's rights movements. As well as problems and stereotypes both men & women face in society, he's a pretty well rounded guy. IMO anywho.

    That sounds very nice and all; I suppose at this point it would be constructive to see what sort of narrative he presents in regards to the Men’s Rights Groups and the issues men and women face.

    On the topic of people tainting an entire movement with poor behavior, take a look at Zac’s post here.

    http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/bbs/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2818669

    Well, looks like he doesn’t want to acknowledge sexism towards men exists, he resorts to the same mockery and shaming tactics as always when a post addressing or criticizing it in an anime comes up.

    It’s no surprise; I expect nothing less from an ignorant slime ball who wants to shut down any possibility of someone else’s perception to maintain his echo chamber of sexism being seen one way. It’s this sort of bullshit that not only makes me brush off people who take on a feminist standpoint, but also makes me begin to despise what the anime fandom could possibly become.

    And what’s up with that “Ugh?” Why do people do that online? Ugh, Ugh, Ugh; yeah, real cool. Online grunting, very cute, makes the person doing it look like they have some sort of mental deficiency parallel to that of a Neanderthal.

    How the hell am I to take feminism seriously when an individual who criticizes something for misandry is called misogynistic by other users and one of the admin? Or when there are idiots like Zac not only representing feminism, but the anime fandom and anime news network?



  • I dunno Neon. He just seems to be reacting to some one else's over reaction.

    But yeah I don't mind keeping you in touch about my GCOMM class through PMs if you like.



  • @Soundmonkey44:

    He just seems to be reacting to some one else's over reaction.

    I find it funny that when a guy criticizes something for an anti-male sentiment or misandry, he’s overreacting, but when someone makes the claim of misogyny, even when it doesn’t even exist, it’s all justified.

    I know you want to defend him, at least it seems that way, but Zac’s a bigoted asshole and bully, and his behavior was more than inappropriate. He and everyone else didn’t even take a second to think it all over before reacting to the post criticizing the anime in question.



  • I just don't think Zac is A bad guy, pretentious & snobbish yea. But with all the crap he has to put up with on a daily basis I don't blame him for being grouchy.



  • @neonwalrus:

    I find it funny that when a guy criticizes something for an anti-male sentiment or misandry, he’s overreacting, but when someone makes the claim of misogyny, even when it doesn’t even exist, it’s all justified.

    I know you want to defend him, at least it seems that way, but Zac’s a bigoted asshole and bully, and his behavior was more than inappropriate. He and everyone else didn’t even take a second to think it all over before reacting to the post criticizing the anime in question.

    Zac has every right to be give the "Gotcha! You're the real sexist!" malarkey the snide, condescending response it deserves.

    Remember the good old days when white heterosexual cis-normative male landowners were marginalized, discriminated against, and denied personal rights? Neither do I. And like it or not, and it does still matter. Art does not exist in a vacuum. It exists within the cultural context that it's viewed in. In this case, that context is several hundred years of people being totally SOL if they weren't born white, straight, male, and into a family of moderate social standing. That's a lot of ingrained social ideology to work through, and we definitely aren't even close to that yet. We're still at the point where female reproductive issues are presided over by committees of old white men who can still remember the Civil Rights Movement happening. Hell, we're still arguing whether or not rape imagery of female characters in media is insensitive or not. And that's a problem. In a perfect world, sexism would just be another awful thing that we generally agreed was awful, with no other connotations, and left it at that, but it's not a perfect world. In fact, it's kind of a shitty world. And throwing around imagery and ideology that may reinforce an internalized sense of cultural antagonism in certain people isn't exactly making it any better. To people who continuously are objectified, belittled, or told to "suck it up, this is how our society works" in their everyday life, it isn't just some arbitrary sentiment that reads as "sexist" - it's something that passively perpetuates attitudes that make life actively harder and worse for them all the time.

    Painting people who contextualize the sexual mistreatment and exploitation of fictional characters as reflective of a culturally internalized mistreatment of actual people as being somehow intellectually compromised is not only silly and reductivist, it's bordering on apologism and victim-blaming. The fact of the matter is that there's basically a 0% chance of me being denied opportunity in life because I don't look like Ryan Gosling. I don't feel the need to put a napkin over my drink when I'm at a bar. I don't feel the need to carry mace or a stungun when I go into town alone. Sometimes I don't even feel the need to comb my hair when I leave the house. Most women don't have that luxury, or at least don't feel like they do. And that's the difference. Misandry in media isn't reinforcing my role as a victimized underclass. It's a reactionary backlash to the opposite of that.

    Yeah, sexism against men is just as bad as it is against women, literally no one is arguing that. But to even imagine it carries the same cultural connotation is just being willfully ignorant of thousands of years of human cultural history that we just started sorting out a few decades ago. Or need I remind you that a not-insignificant chunk of my country still believes in the literal interpretation of a 2000-year-old desert tome that says the punishment for raping an unwed girl is to pay her father 50 pieces of silver and marry her? You'll excuse me if I think my Y-chromosome-bearing brethren have comparatively less shit to work through in regards to our cultural portrayal in media.



  • @Soundmonkey44:

    I just don't think Zac is A bad guy, pretentious & snobbish yea. But with all the crap he has to put up with on a daily basis I don't blame him for being grouchy.

    It doesn’t give him a “get out of jail free” card to be a bigoted asshole, we don’t offer such leeway when someone denies sexism towards women exists; if feminism is about equality; he should be called out and denounced, not endorsed.

    @Renzokuken:

    Zac has every right to be give the "Gotcha! You're the real sexist!" malarkey the snide, condescending response it deserves.

    He has the right to voice his opinion, but when he acts like an unprofessional bully, I notice, and it doesn't help him and what he believes in.

    My animosity towards feminism is their failure to acknowledge that sexism goes both ways, and the fact that he didn't listen and resorted to bully tactics only conveys that he's not a very tactful, or professional person.

    @Renzokuken:

    Remember the good old days when white heterosexual cis-normative male landowners were marginalized, discriminated against, and denied personal rights?

    Oh, you mean when the common man had to work himself to death and eventually lay his life down in the First World War to get the vote, and women shamed them into enlisting with the white feather campaign.

    @Renzokuken:

    And like it or not, and it does still matter.

    It’s 2014, and statistics have changed, with domestic violence numbers virtually identical, and women more likely to abuse using a weapon; or boiling water or throwing a cup; two of my favorites. When rape numbers are close to the same between men and women, with the likelihood that young boys may be raped more than young girls.



  • @Renzokuken:

    Hell, we're still arguing whether or not rape imagery of female characters in media is insensitive or not. And that's a problem.

    It depends on the context; if it’s glorified and trivialized, then that would be pretty bad, however, most rape of female characters I see in any form of media is usually shown for what it is; grotesque and disgusting. Why would it be included? Maybe to show how horrible and dehumanizing it is. It could be used to show what a degenerate scumbag a character is; our society perceives rape as one of the worst crimes, and rightfully so. It could be a component of a character's development, why they're depressed, or have mental and social issues as was the case with characters like Casca from Berserk or Satillizer from Freezing.

    If a character commits rape it could be a conveyance of their fall from grace as they did with Griffith from Berserk; the scene was difficult to watch, but it did show that Griffith was broken. Like I said, we as a society don't look to kindly on rape.

    On the other hand, male rape in media, as is the case with violence is often portrayed as comedic. I can only think of two occasions where this wasn't the case; the book called “The Wars” about the First World War where the protagonist was sexually abused by his mother, and then he was raped by some other men. Then there was American History X where Edward Norton’s character was raped.

    @Renzokuken:

    And throwing around imagery and ideology that may reinforce an internalized sense of cultural antagonism in certain people isn't exactly making it any better.

    Internalized? When you have an Ex –Girlfriend who clobbered you for no good reason, or when you’ve been raped and you go to seek help and people won’t listen, or ask what you did to make them mad; then come talk to me.

    @Renzokuken:

    To people who continuously are objectified, belittled, or told to "suck it up, this is how our society works" in their everyday life, it isn't just some arbitrary sentiment that reads as "sexist" - it's something that passively perpetuates attitudes that make life actively harder and worse for them all the time.

    What you said applies to the male and female genders, not just one; it’s what we need to get away from. I've been told countless times to "suck it up" "man up" or "deal with it" when it comes to my personal problems.

    @Renzokuken:

    Painting people who contextualize the sexual mistreatment and exploitation of fictional characters as reflective of a culturally internalized mistreatment of actual people as being somehow intellectually compromised is not only silly and reductivist, it's bordering on apologism and victim-blaming.

    No, I’m outlining someone’s bigotry, and once again, fictional characters of both genders are mistreated. With movies like Thelma & Louise that not only glorify violence towards men, but endorse it along with many of the “hate” art I’ve seen directed at men; the pendulum swings both ways. My attitude is if you’re going to call out sexism when it applies to one group; you’d better be ready to do so for the other group, not “well it’s different.”

    It’s precisely why I don’t consider an anime like Free, or some Yaoi fan girl bait to be sexist towards men; as a matter of fact, I have no right to; it would make me a hypocrite because I don’t consider Queen’s Blade to be sexist towards women. You may disagree with this sentiment in the sense that I don't find eroticism in the anime offensive, and that's fine if you're offended both ways; I’m consistent; logic I apply to one side, I take the other way too.

    The issue with people looking at everything as sexist to women is it keeps them in state of perpetual victim-hood; it’s disrespectful and demeaning to women just as much as it “others” men.

    @Renzokuken:

    I don't feel the need to carry mace or a stungun when I go into town alone.

    You should; as a male you’re 3 – 5 times more likely to be the victim of a violent crime up to and including homicide, I'm sure as hell I don't feel safe walking around alone at night, shit, I almost got mugged a few times. As for the implications of this statement; women are far less likely to be attacked, and a majority of rapes, 75% in fact are perpetrated by someone the victim knows; and what she’s wearing makes no difference.

    So I don’t believe in these assholes who “slut shame” women by telling them “they’re asking for it” because they dress a certain way, the clothing makes no difference whatsoever.

    That; is acknowledging sexism swings both ways, and Men’s Rights Groups know this as well.

    @Renzokuken:

    Sometimes I don't even feel the need to comb my hair when I leave the house.

    Well good for you, that is your choice, but when men look like slobs, they’re often dismissed by people, and the bottom line is good grooming is a human condition.

    You go out for a job interview wearing torn up clothes, dandruff hair, stinking like BO, and your mouth smells like you use dog shit for toothpaste people aren’t going to hire you or want to hang out with you.

    @Renzokuken:

    Most women don't have that luxury, or at least don't feel like they do.

    The key word here is feeling, but they do have that luxury to go without, in my experience, and this may sound mean, but a lot of women I know actually like doing themselves up. I’m not going to argue with them, they can do as they please.

    It depends on the type of work they do; I deal with some women truck drivers, and yes, some are attractive, I’ll be honest; but they don’t do themselves up, there’s no point. They have to wear the same protective equipment everyone else does when on site. Even with this; I still shower and comb up my hair every day for work.

    I see and know women are every bit as shallow as men when it comes to these appearances; everybody is both men and women; saying it only affects one group is downright silly. These are human issues, not singular gender issues.

    @Renzokuken:

    And that's the difference. Misandry in media isn't reinforcing my role as a victimized underclass. It's a reactionary backlash to the opposite of that.

    Ah yes, an elaborate “misandry isn’t real” argument, like I haven’t heard this before. So I suppose those councillors asking what I did to piss off my abusive ex-girlfriend aren’t enough. Or the many men I’ve seen at the support groups with identical problems.

    @Renzokuken:

    Yeah, sexism against men is just as bad as it is against women, literally no one is arguing that.

    Then why did you take all that time to write a post that paints women as the innocent victims? Then you back up a bigot like Zac, and nobody here, besides myself has talked about sexism towards men. And why is it that when it’s brought up in any other forum, the person doing so is (a)misogynist? (b)the discussion is spun so that sexism towards men is ultimately sexism towards women?

    I think the best thing I can say to this is; you could’ve fooled me.

    Look, with any art, if you want to call something misogynistic or misandristic; you have the freedom to do that; I may disagree, but I won’t insult you; I’ll tell you why I might disagree, but that’s it. That’s the difference between a guy like me, and a person like Zac.

    And no, it’s not just claims of misogyny I disagree with; a few times on the on the men’s rights forum, I have disagreed with some of the misandry claims.

    Once, there was an anime thread was started, some of us began posting and talking our favorite shows, then two or three users had to come in and call a majority of anime misandric garbage. I had the exact same reaction to them as I do feminists; what the fuck? How so?

    It was the same with movies like Deathproof, I can see how someone would think it misandric, but no, same with wreck it Ralph; and I came to that movie’s defense saying no, it’s the complete opposite of misandry; it’s recognizing and respecting the guy who has the shit job.

    Speaking of shit jobs; while a majority of CEO’s and politicians are male; the vast majority of homeless and shit work jobs are men as well. Why do you think 95% of workplace injuries and fatalities are men?

    So if there’s a glass ceiling; there’s a glass cellar populated mostly by men.

    @Renzokuken:

    But to even imagine it carries the same cultural connotation is just being willfully ignorant of thousands of years of human cultural history that we just started sorting out a few decades ago.

    Well, men were just as much victims of their gender roles as women were; they literally worked themselves to death to provide a comfortable life to their partners, while their partners didn't get much for choice. The bottom line, both genders were pigeonholed into their gender expected roles.

    @Renzokuken:

    Or need I remind you that a not-insignificant chunk of my country still believes in the literal interpretation of a 2000-year-old desert tome that says the punishment for raping an unwed girl is to pay her father 50 pieces of silver and marry her?

    I don’t know where you get that from, but it is pretty outrageous.

    @Renzokuken:

    You'll excuse me if I think my Y-chromosome-bearing brethren have comparatively less shit to work through in regards to our cultural portrayal in media.

    Then I would say you’re ignorant; men are still stuck in their gender roles as provider and protector because most women are not after a house husband.

    As for the cultural portrayals; I do touch on that in several ways, if I can ever get my write up done; what makes a hero? The Crash Test Dummy Trope, and female empowerment at the expense of the male gender.



  • @neonwalrus:

    No, I’m outlining someone’s bigotry, and once again, fictional characters of both genders are mistreated. With movies like Thelma & Louise that not only glorify violence towards men, but endorse it along with many of the “hate” art I’ve seen directed at men; the pendulum swings both ways. My attitude is if you’re going to call out sexism when it applies to one group; you’d better be ready to do so for the other group, not “well it’s different.”

    I agree. A lot of people criticize Bella Swan from Twilight for being a sexist depiction of women by having her sit back in a corner while Edward, Jacob, or anyone else protects her, yet nobody calls Yukiteru Amano from Future Diary a sexist depiction of men by having him sit back in a corner while Yuno protects him.



  • @iamshodan:

    I agree. A lot of people criticize Bella Swan from Twilight for being a sexist depiction of women by having her sit back in a corner while Edward, Jacob, or anyone else protects her, yet nobody calls Yukiteru Amano from Future Diary a sexist depiction of men by having him sit back in a corner while Yuno protects him.

    I see what you say, and that does happen often, the whole it’s only sexist when it’s done one way, but I have also encountered with some guys I talk to who take on more of an MRA stance, who, in similar fashion to feminists I know, tend to call out some pretty trivial matters when it comes to sexism against men.

    One example is one user on another forum I go to claimed that Attack on Titan was sexist to the male gender because he felt the male character in it were weak. Now, I haven’t seen all of Attack on Titan, but no, the men are not weak on it, and add to that the fact

    ! Bertolt Hoover is the Colossal Titan.

    Another example are a few guys who somehow believe Sekirei is sexist towards men because the men seem to be portrayed as weak, stupid, perverted, crazy, greedy or just plain immoral. This is where I heavily disagree; I don’t feel Sekirei was sexist to anyone, least of all men. There were some pretty cold hearted female characters on it, and the men, while they had their flaws, were portrayed as intelligent for the most part.

    It’s pretty much what I’ve seen feminists do in terms of calling a piece of entertainment sexist because it might have more male characters who are the main characters while the female ones are more a part of the supporting cast while saying female dominated shows are fine.

    Some Men’s Rights guys are doing the exact same thing by calling something like Princess Jellyfish, or Puella Magi Madoka Magica sexist because there’s not much of a male presence on these shows, but defend any male dominated entertainment.

    I’m sorry, but most of the claims of sexism from both sides are over some very trivial and superficial matters not to mention; if it’s sexist when done to men, it’s sexist when done to women; it’s about maintaining logical consistency. So, this isn’t an “I’m going to pick on, criticise feminism only” sentiment. Most of the time, when people call sexism on anything, be it towards men or women, most of the time I shake my head and disagree.

    The bottom line, is for me to consider anything sexist to men or women, I really need to see that animosity and hostility conveyed in the artwork. It’s one reason why, despite the erotic cinematography I don’t consider Queen’s Blade sexist at all, and I have no issue with Free or anything that is has male eroticism in it; but because a series like Elfen Lied or Rin seem to relish in its graphic violence towards the female gender then I call sexism or in these cases outright misogyny. It’s the same when Kirie beats on Yukinari who is one third her size and he doesn’t deserve it, so the power dynamic is in her favor and it’s played to be comedic when if we switched the genders it would be unacceptable; and rightfully so.



  • @neonwalrus:

    One example is one user on another forum I go to claimed that Attack on Titan was sexist to the male gender because he felt the male character in it were weak. Now, I haven’t seen all of Attack on Titan, but no, the men are not weak on it, and add to that the fact

    ! Bertolt Hoover is the Colossal Titan.

    Just going to point out that that is a MAJOR spoiler of a reveal that is not at all covered in the anime. Nobody should click on it if they are not through volume 10 of the manga or do not care about being spoiled.

    But anyway… Did he say why they thought it was sexist towards men, other than "they're weak"? Because Eren's pretty strong and very determined. Levi's humanity's strongest soldier, and his Special Ops squad consisting of some of the Survey Corps's best soldiers was all male aside from Petra. Erwin is a highly capable and intelligent leader. Armin, while not physically strong, is capable of quick thinking and problem solving. Jean struggles with his desire to retreat to the Interior and ends up choosing to fight on the front lines in spite of his fears, and is also one of the top ten of the 104th Trainees, as are Bertolt and Reiner. Those are some of the more prominent male characters in the series.

    It’s pretty much what I’ve seen feminists do in terms of calling a piece of entertainment sexist because it might have more male characters who are the main characters while the female ones are more a part of the supporting cast while saying female dominated shows are fine.

    Some Men’s Rights guys are doing the exact same thing by calling something like Princess Jellyfish, or Puella Magi Madoka Magica sexist because there’s not much of a male presence on these shows, but defend any male dominated entertainment.

    Yeah, this is something I've always thought was dumb. So if a show has a single female/male character, but that character is well-written and treated fairly, it's still sexist just because they're the only one?

    But, as for iamshodan's post about Twilight: The problem is that it reinforces negative stereotypes through Bella (being very passive, and for the me the worst part is that she is living only for her relationship/unable to live without her man and overall dependency on Edward/Jacob for everything). It's toxic in that it presents a highly unhealthy relationship as an ideal. Edward is a stalker and very controlling, and Bella thinks his behavior is sweet and loving and as a result the books don't portray his behavior as problematic since it's all told in first-person (the first movie didn't seem to frame things any differently, but I haven't seen the other ones nor do I ever want to). Bella's very passive and dependent, and she practically gives up on living after Edward leaves her, even going so far as to jump off a freaking cliff.

    I've not seen Future Diary to comment on it but I don't think a character being "weak" is a negative on its own. Men are, or should be, allowed to be weak. No man should be required to be "manly" 24/7. There are incredibly difficult situations and it'd be unrealistic for a character, regardless of gender, to just be able to brush it all off as no big deal and keep powering through everything. Women are, or should be, allowed to be weak. They don't have to go out and mow down an army to be good characters. But in Bella's case, her dependency and passiveness (her "weakness") defines her character with there being essentially nothing else of note to her, all the while she's portrayed as the type of girl girls wish they were. It reinforces the stereotype that women should be passive and dependent.



  • @Firefly:

    Just going to point out that that is a MAJOR spoiler of a reveal that is not at all covered in the anime. Nobody should click on it if they are not through volume 10 of the manga or do not care about being spoiled.

    Well, I’ll give some background on that; after I saw Eren transform, I took a few factors into account:

    ! The Armored and Colossal Titans can actually think, and they just seem to vanish into thin air, add to that after seeing Eren transform, I realized, they have to be human titans. Since the series injects a lot of emphasis on the political and economic factors into the story with the elite class wanting to maintain control, these human titans are in on the conspiracy by joining the corps and setting everything into motion. How I found out was that I was talking to my roommate and my suspicions were confirmed when she told me who they were and how they were behind all of it.

    @Firefly:

    But anyway… Did he say why they thought it was sexist towards men, other than "they're weak"? Because Eren's pretty strong and very determined. Levi's humanity's strongest soldier, and his Special Ops squad consisting of some of the Survey Corps's best soldiers was all male aside from Petra. Erwin is a highly capable and intelligent leader. Armin, while not physically strong, is capable of quick thinking and problem solving. Jean struggles with his desire to retreat to the Interior and ends up choosing to fight on the front lines in spite of his fears, and is also one of the top ten of the 104th Trainees, as are Bertolt and Reiner. Those are some of the more prominent male characters in the series.

    See, and I’ve been currently watching the series off and on this weekend, and I’m just not seeing how this series could even possibly be considered sexist towards men.

    Here, I’ll show you guys the post:

    @BC:

    why are all the badasses in the military women and all the men weak little b*tches?

    is this a feminist anime? is that why its so popular?

    if the creators wanted to subvert genre tropes they could've done it in a way less hackneyed way

    So, yeah, not much of an explanation, and after watching more of the series, total bullshit; it’s pretty clear after my posts here that I’m anti-feminist and lean more towards humanist/MRA thinking, but I can’t agree to a claim of sexism when it’s painfully obvious there’s no sexism there to begin with. Attack on Titan has no anti-male bias.

    @Firefly:

    Yeah, this is something I've always thought was dumb. So if a show has a single female/male character, but that character is well-written and treated fairly, it's still sexist just because they're the only one?

    Go look up the Bechdel Test; and the sad thing; people actually believe in it and use it as a legitimate measuring tool; that would make Queen’s Blade not only the perfect feminist anime, but completely misandristic if, just for a laugh, apply this test to men. This is why I took a lot of time writing the chapter called “Failure of the Bechdel Test” and its intrusion on artistic integrity.



  • Concerning Attack on Titan:

    ! I guessed Reiner was one in the ep where the Female Titan catches him in her hand, and going off of that I assumed Bertolt was one as well, but yeah, it's not officially confirmed until later in the series, in a rather sloppy way if I might add.

    He doesn't even give examples. :\ The only male character I can really see fitting into what he described would be Armin, but as I said, he's got his own strengths to make up for lack of physical strength. Physical strength isn't everything. Maybe Hannes as well after he breaks down in tears after saving Eren and Mikasa but failing to save their mother. But seriously, what person wouldn't in his place? A friend of his died and he's dealing with her children in the immediate wake of the incident (while still in danger) after "failing" to find the courage necessary to fight Smiles (my new name for that Titan), though in turn he managed to secure Eren and Mikasa's safety instead of risking all four of their lives like a fool. What are the chances he'd ever fought a Titan before?

    And yup, know all about the Bechdel Test. Not a fan. I get the concept, but in reality it's far from fool-proof. And I fear that it could give way to a checklist mentality of how to pass it instead of just naturally developing well-rounded characters.

    Anywho, I fear this discussion has long left Ms. Sarkeesian and her videos behind and has become more general in focus. :P But yeah, has she released anything new since Ms. Male Character? I don't actively seek her videos out, but I guess I'll go check. Still think she should have a discussion video as part of this series, just because I'd be interested in hearing her responses to arguments against some of what she says.



  • @Firefly:

    Concerning Attack on Titan:

    This has nothing to do with anything except for the context in my own mind, but please do me a favor and never change your avatar ever again. Doing so would be a complete travesty



  • I'm not sure what to make of that….

    I was planning on keeping it for a while, though, it's one of my favorite scenes in the series. :P I've been trying to find a good shot of Kaiki for a replacement, but it's slow going.